How to get rid of water in underground sprinkler pipes and fix tee thread joint leaks with minimal digging

Some of the pop-up sprinkler in the lawn leaks.  It's not the sprinkler.  Must be the threaded joint in the tee down below or worse. It turns out that my ex-gardener used a metal nipple to joint the tee below to the sprinkler.  That means he repaired the bad thread by making it worse.  I don't know how many he did.  If the sprinklers are not near the concrete driveway, it's hardly noticeable.

It's never easy to replace a section of PVC pipe, not to mention an underground tee piece.  You need at least two bulky unions or worse, two extendable repair pipe sections.  The total cost is silly when a tee is some 20 cents.  For me the labour cost is infinite as I have to dig out enough soil for all those things to get in and under.

I searched the net for ideas and found only one video inspiring.  Of course it is in you-tube.  All credit to him.  What he did was drill the thread joint to enlarge it to become a slip joint.  And sand down a short pvc section to glue to it.  Then you can attach anything to the other end, use a shorter sprinkler or install a flexible swing joint.

After drilling the thread joint on the tee, I think it's easier to drill enough so you can screw in a pvc male section, or just a threaded nipple that you would normally use.  So it depends.  If the thread are very loose, it may be easier to turn it into a full slip joint.  My threads are all "screwed up" so I can't even screw in a nipple.  After drilling with a 3/4" wood hole drill, I can screw in a nipple and have a rather rigid joint.  The nipple doesn't wobble.  There seems to be some good thread left or the bad thread still holds the nipple in position.   If I use PVC glue to seal the thread it would be better than a slip joint.  The PVC glue weld both pieces together to form one single piece with the same thermal properties.

Now the only thing to do is to dry the tee and apply the glue.  It turns out to be impossible.  Closing the water supply, turning on the valves doesn't drain the pipes.  Taking off the entire sprinkler down the slope doesn't drain the pipes.  Blowing air into the pipe with my air bed pump will get rid of water for a moment until more water come back.  I searched the web for ideas and time and time again they use air compressor to force water out of the pipes and out of the other sprinklers.

I don't have an air compressor and it's silly to rent one for a simple job.  I have a hand pump that is ideal but it is for oil change.  I can still use it but then I will be polluting if I just pour the water down the drain.  Pond pumps will be ideal for 1/4" tubes but they don't have inlets.

You-tube have plenty of water pumps that use electric air pump as the driving force.  The problem is that you can't get an air tube down the tee bottom with enough space for an inlet/outlet tube.  Without that you can't lift water with air - the principle of air lift pumps.  I spent a few days in experiments on and off to realize that.

The other possibility is venturi water pump.  But water pumps using that principle are probably not using that principle.

Just when I'm ready to order a real water pump I remembered that I have this:

 

It's as good a pump as anything.  I repaired the broken tube with packing tape, and taped a 1/2" pvc pipe to the hose end.  I have the 1/2" to 1/4" tubing adaptor.  It takes less than a minute to suck out all the water, not even one bucket full.  I also have a wet vac which is easier to attach a pipe to it.  Silly me.  But then I have no idea why everybody use compress air to blow out.

All the time and effort works out.  I saved some money and delivery time.  I learned some science.  I don't need to spend money on tools I already have with superior performance.  The pay off will be coming when I have to check and repair god knows how many sprinklers.

Total solution: Under sink pop-up ball rod too short

Firstly, the pop-up assembly can be beautiful if you use expensive copper pipes or aluminium tubes, and maybe spray paint it too.  I use left over pvc pipes so it cost nothing and earn from freed storage space.

The old short horizontal pop-up ball rod is still there.  I extend the length by putting a 1/2" cpvc tube on the outside of it.  For my case there is not enough space to put the cpvc tube without cutting it in two half first.  So I use a cpvc coupler to join it again after they are in position.  I have to do that because if I don't have access to the ball rod when I screw the ball in, I can't get the rod through the stopper hole.

To reduce play (side way movement) between the old ball rod and the cpvc tube, I put in between them a 5/8" tubing, the thicker version for fridge ice maker.  The OD, outer diameter of the rod is usually 1/4", same as majority of tubes for fridge ice maker.  The next size tubing has ID, internal diameter, of 1/4", with OD 5/8" (I think).  Therefore the thinner tubes can be inserted into the thicker ones.  The tubing also prevents the outer rod from sliding horizontally.  If you need to you can add glue to fix the outer cpvc tube.

The horizontal pop-up ball rod is connected to the vertical pull rod by a 3/4" pvc tee piece as shown.  That's the next size pipe that allows the horizontal rod (tube) to go through while allowing some play.

The tee piece is fixed to the vertical pull rod via a short vertical pvc pipe section.  The vertical pull rod is universally connected to a flat bar with holes in it.  A simple screw will fix the pvc pipe onto the bar securely.  First I drill through the pipe with a plastic bit.  I use a long precise dry wall screw to nail the pipe and bar together.  It's better to use nut and bolt.

For the horizontal rod you can also use 1/2" emt pipes for conduits.  It's cheaper and can be easily cut using the cheapest copper pipe cutters.  CPVC was phased out already.  I just had some in the garage. 

Install utility sink at outdoor kitchen cleanout

In many places the plumbing code requires an outdoor clean-out near the kitchen sink.  It took me many years to find out what it is.  Also in these places, most likely it is frowned upon to discharge waste water outside, or even wash your car.

Our kitchen sink clog often, or drain very slowly, like once a month.  I used fine metal mesh filters at the twin sinks.  I even installed a mesh filter down at the trap.  It didn't matter.  I suspected my wife bypass the filters.  But it must be grease and other stuff like rice, but mostly grease.  We don't fry and so we don't have grease that we pour into the sink.  But we stir fry a lot and the residue oil cannot be poured elsewhere.

I thought of installing a grease trap as in the restaurants but it is too expensive.  The undersink is already reserved for a 4 gal reverse osmosis system.  And you have to maintain it like washing the filters.

I have everything to clear clogs and I'm well trained at all those.  Once I snaked until the entire length of the snake is in.  An online plumber told me in that case my snake would have traversed the whole house and reached the sidewalk in front of the house.  That wasn't a real solution.  I hate snaking.  You can't leave the dirty snake inside the garage.  If you clean it you have to add oil.  I don't have an outdoor drain to clean anything.  When it's not too late I can pour a gal of drain cleaner into the kitchen sink.  That would work overnight, but not less than a gal.  The other thing is at least 8 oz of sulphuric acid that work every time, but I am afraid I would damage the pipes if I apply once a month.  And I have to pour at the clean-out.  Anyway, chemicals are too expensive and environmental unfriendly.  It's like pouring a $10 note down the drain every time.

For years I pour the dirty bucket of mob water into the toilet after my wife did the cleaning.  When we have to wash anything bigger and dirty we have to do it in the bathtub.  And after some oil change or repair, I hate to bring myself, tools, and anything toxic into the house for cleaning.  I don't want anything to accumulate at the yard too.

The more I look at it, the more I am convinced that I cannot install a sink outdoors.  I have to find the right section of pipe near the wall, beak the wall, install a tee and seal the wall.

But I have added pipes at the cleanout to make it easier to add chemicals, friendlier chemicals that you have to add more often.  I even thought of adding a small sink for RV's to enlarge the end of pipe.

But now I found the solution.  Big laundry / utility sinks that have stands on it's own, to be installed at the cleanout.

I didn't want it to be big.  But they all come in that size suitable for the laundry.  Big has it's advantages.  When the pipes down the kitchen sink clogs, you have a big reservoir to allow water backup, before dirt water backup into the kitchen sink.  Or, depending on the height of the sink, dirt water will overflow outside and never backup into the kitchen sink.  Both have it's merits and disadvantages.

You need a p-trap under the utility sink, just as you need one under the kitchen sink.  That would prevent sewage gas (bad smell) from escaping.  Why I didn't think of that?

The joints are screw at the cleanout, and slip-joints with compression screws elsewhere, the most common types.  Typically, the slip-joints can be unscrewed and taken out rapidly by hand.  But you should design the cleanout joint section so that it's simple to unscrew.  You can add a permanent section while still be able to put in a snake.  But it would be difficult to put in a pressure bladder without direct access to the cleanout.  The bladder is the most convenient equipment and effective that I love.

It helps a lot if the sink is light weight.  The weight of the sinks surprised me.  At the hardware store, the sinks weight like huge stone.  For the cheapest one I got online, I can lift it with one hand, with the steel legs included!  So if you prepare to access the cleanout often, you should get a light weight one so you can lift the whole thing away.

And since the sink is moving, I should have got a p-trap with a flexible pipe section.  I can joint the parts together perfectly with addition slip jointed pieces and ABS glue.  But when the sink moves, perfect alignment cannot be maintained all the time.  The legs rest on a flower bed.

You might be able to get all the parts without the need for glue.  But for my case I already have a PVC (white) piece and ABS (pipe).  So I adapt them to the PVC p-trap.  If you really have to glue different materials together, do not use any super dupper glues for boats.  Different materials will expand and contract in different rates.  There are transition glues designed for gluing PVC to ABS.  But I saved money.  Someone reported experiments with all the combinations of glues and mismatch.  He reported anything goes without problem.  Another found out too late and have to dig out the yard to correct the mistake just in case.  He reported that PVC glue did nothing much to the ABS.  So I used the ABS glue I have to save money.  The pipes are never under pressure and are outside over the flower bed.

Now I can clean stuff contaminated with pet waste outside.  I can clean my car with the two bucket method without pouring the dirty water into the flower bed or into the toilet after bringing it all the way into the house.  I may use mob again that do not need to be cleaned using the washing machine.  Life is good, until the kitchen clogs.

ps The most good that came out of it.  You know water will backup before water backup into the sink.  When the tap is on, water will flow normally for a few minutes before slowing down or backup into the sink.  The outdoor sink, usually on a lower level, will give you early warning.  And if the next day you see some food residue in the sink, you know water was there when the dishwasher drains overnight.

Mystery solved: sneaky leaks and persistence pipe noises in the wall

It started when there were strange noises after a bath or shower in the upstair bathtub.  It sounds like droplets of water falling from great height.  The frequency will diminish quickly into once per minute and much less, but will last hours after a bath.  I suspect that there is a leak in the drain pipes.  Water drips very slowly but falls from 2nd floor straight down into the ground, hitting some hollow pipes or other amplifications.  Or that something in the 20 year old pipe system held up water, and drips slowly inside the pipes, falling straight down over great height.

I never had a oscillating tool before and opening a dry wall is the last thing I would do in my house.  I never cut open a hole in a dry wall.  I don't know how to cut.  Drilling holes, cut by utility knife seems to be so primitive.  In addition, how to cover that irregular hole as if nothing happened?

Also we had a pinhole leak in the copper pipe once a couple of years back.  It was near the same tub, under the HAC blower.  So I cut open the bare floor board instead to have a look.  I replaced the leaking pipe section with a short flexible connector.  It was a hard to reach area from there so I opted for shark bite connectors and a flexible reinforced tube with screwed ends, with a seal inside.  I always think it's a bad job breaking all plumbing codes, and may have small leaks.  But we never saw water sipping into the ceiling downstairs again.

So I suspect there may be water collected somewhere between the walls or the ceilings.  And may be toxic mold or rots.  It could be scary and hopeless so I postpone looking into it unless I am fully ready no matter what.  I was never ready.

Then, instead of water sipping through the ceiling, a pool water was collected in the ceiling, enough to open a hole in the dry wall.  Luckily, there wasn't much water and it was only after a shower or bath.

This is where the mystery begins.  It's not like water will leak during the shower.  It's unpredictable.  I can even waited for weeks without water coming down all the time.

Then I summoned all the protective gears and all the courage to confront the toxic mold. I knocked off the dry wall around the ceiling hole for the 1st time in 20 years, after the house was built.

That would be called the crawling space I think, between the upstairs floor board and the downstairs ceiling.  There's nothing.  The dry wall around the hole is still pretty much dry.  The floor board looks dry and so is the studs.  The ABS drain pipes are pretty dry though with some water stains near the bottom of the under side of the tub.  And yes, the tub is directly above me.  The replaced copper pipe section looks brand new and the rest of the copper pipes seem to be in good condition and dry.

There are visible spider webs and old rat bites on some pipe insulation materials.  The rat infestation would have been dealt with when we moved in.  That's it.  No horrible stuff.

Obviously the drain pipes wasn't leaking and couldn't identify the source of the leak and noise from where I could see.

When cold water is turned on fully, nothing will happen.  All sorts of things happen only when the hot water is turned on.  So I suspect the faucet leaks at the hot water inlet.  As there is no height for water drops to make great noises, I also suspect something fishy at the copper pipe at top of the shower.

I could have knocked down the whole dry wall behind the tub immediately to get to the hot water supply.  But fortunately, behind the tub, there is a space for the HAC.  I can't get to the tub from behind because the one storey HAC blocks everything.  I can know down the dry walls, but can't put it back without moving out the huge HAC system.

I can knock down the tiles at the tub side to get to the faucet and pipes.  But then I have to use an oscillator tool to cut out the tiles, and then cut the backing board.  The pipes also go through holes in some studs.  Putting back everything is much worse.

So I did more diagnosis to make sure.  The copper pipe at top of the shower is dry.  You can hear the pipe noises as soon as the hot water is turned on, but it's hard to see water leaking.  I actually observed under the tub when everybody took showers and baths in the morning before work and school.  People come and go.  I can only conclude that there is no leaks.  Until my wife was in the tub for a while.  Then about a cup of water ran down the drain pipes, then stops.

So I did a final test.  Nothing happens unless I turn on the hot shower for over 5 minutes.  Nothing even if the hot faucet is fully on.  Water will start dripping down the drain pipes after 5 minutes of hot shower, and only hot shower.

The next phrase is to turn to the internet for solutions.  The first thing I hit is that ABS drain pipes were found to be defective in the 80's.  There was class actions.  My pipes should be slightly newer but the builder may use stocks several years old.  That seems a good explanation.   I should be replacing the drain pipes under the tub.  That's a horrible thought.  I have to make a big hole to crawl in and under the spiderwebs, not knowing if I can reach the back of the tub down there.

They say to look for repeated repair around the pipes.  Yes, the joints look shiny new but the pipe itself look beaten with water stains.  (But of course the joins look shiny and new with the protection of the ABS glue.)  There are a lot of couplings and turns under the tub so I guess that's right.

Someone argues to apply and apply ABS glue around the joints to fix the leaks.  Some suggest to use marine glues and repairs.  I concluded that ABS glue is the way to go because I know it welds the joints together into one piece, and that the whole piece contracts and expands as one, without extra stress.

I could have done that but then the water seems to come from the joints but really not.  It came from further up, just following the pipes down.

But then it dawned on me that the pipe noises are not caused by water leaks but by thermal expansion.  I found the information that they expand a lot and you have to allow for that in proper installation.  They must have hired a cowboy to do that in my house.  Not only they violation all codes for expansion (if they have that then), they did the minimum effort to allow the pipes to turn corners and down the wall.

So I realized that whenever I turn on the hot water, the thumping noises start, vigorously at first and then taper off when all the pipes are warm.  When the hot water is off, the noise will come back.  It thump once or less per minute and last for hours.

It's funny that we had been looking to move up and opened our house for showing with appointments.  It's very embarrassing when someone came in and hear a loud thump inside the wall in the middle of the living room.  I told my wife please don't take a shower less than a couple of hours before an appointment.

If I had known that, I could just run a lot of cold water down the drain after a hot shower, until the noise stops.  It's as quick as the noise starts.

I cut larger the holes in the studs where the drain pipes went through.  But I can't do anything when the pipes go into the vertical wall.  I suspect the pipe is pressed against a lot of studs along the height of the wall.  I thought of opening the wall to cure that, or to cut out the pipes to add a flexible section.  At the end, compared with doing nothing, with cutting out everything with no guarantee, I opted for the former.  But I don't understand why in the first 10 years we don't have any expansion noise.  Or did we not?

With one mystery solved, I went on to philosophies where the water came from.  I concluded that it's the overflow drain hole.  The seal or the pipes degenerates and water leak from there.  My reason?  When water drips down, it will look like coming from leaking pipe joints.  And it takes over 5 minutes during a hot shower for hot water to condense in the drain cover and enough to run down the pipes outside.

Now I can see the water coming but then how is it so unpredictable?  I'm much better than the plumber in this.  My wife is a compulsive person.  After summer vacation, she took a good bath, washed the bathtub, and used the shower head to spray and clean everything, including the overflow plate.  That explained there were enough water to make a hole in the ceiling.

And that a compulsive person particularly like to flush a lot of clean water into some perceived dark and dirty places, like the overflow drain.  That explains why nothing happened when I was observing under the tub, until my wife came along and until the end of her shower.  She cleaned the bathtub!

So I read on the internet that the overflow seal is a common part to be replaced.  I opened the cover plate and saw that it is.  My tub wall look straight and flat so I tried to get a flat gasket instead of a tapered/bevelled one.  Only the depot have the ones large enough for my grand old tub.  I got one but it turned out to be tapered.  I found only one on the internet that is flat.  I ordered but never came.  I asked online if the one at depot is flat.  I ordered one before the manufacturer answered.  All are tapered.

That wasted me a whole week when there is a big hole in my ceiling under ugly pipes.  But then it dawned on me that a flat straight wall doesn't necessarily use a flat gasket.  I tried to put in the tapered one and it seemed that it didn't fit.  I looked at the old one fallen down through the ceiling.  It was totally degenerated but it could be tapered.  I opened the overflow drain cover again.  I rotated the gasket upside down and there was a better fit.  I was silly to put in the other way around and claim unfit.  Then I rotate the gasket slightly to get the best fit.  Then I closed the cover tight.  I tested the seal with the shower head and then an overflowing tub.  It worked.  Just the overflow opening is not big enough to prevent overflow at maximum flow.  But that's immaterial.  We have children and will never fill a tub that way.

OK, everything explained, no serious damaged and everything fixed, except for the noise and hole in the ceiling.  It also explains why there is some water stain at the ceiling in the garage under the 2nd bathtub.  But I have no rush to fix that.  I just told my wife don't do that to the other overflow drain until I change the gasket.

Defeating the Flushmaster patent: automatic toilet bowl cleaner

You really never have to brush the toilet bowl again for less than $1.  You only need to open the toilet tank maybe once every 6 month and drop some super cheap household chemicals in it.

My previous improved version of the Flushmaster split the water from the fill tube into 2 paths, but still using the Flushmaster.  It was a temporary fix for prove of concept.  Once the concept is proven, using the Flushmaster is totally unnecessary, overly complicated, inconvenient, and unreliable.

Since my new design is patentable, I look up the patents reluctantly.  Reluctantly because there's not much money to be made because everybody can build it for less than $1.  But still, many people will still want to just buy and drop one in the tank and forget about it.  Fortunately, Flushmaster has already patented the concepts in 2007, so I can disclose my findings immediately and not spend my time in the toilet business.

The current Flushmaster gadget is patented about 2001.  Why they don't give you products with the new 2007 patent? Money!  Now the refill cartridge sells for $7 (?) and last for about a month for a large family with older high flow toilets.  That's totally not bad if you don't have a cleaner/house keeper.  That's a steady revenue stream that the new produce will decimate.  And if you see the new thing, probably you want to copy it for less than $1.

Overflow tubes are 1" pipes slightly narrower than standard PVC 1" pipes.  So the whole thing is based on 1" pipes and fittings.  In this final assembly, the Tee on the right just slides onto the overflow tube.  Nothing is needed to modify permanently any existing fittings.

For this design, the chamber on the left stands on the tank bottom.  This is not necessary.  To secure the assembly in place all you need to do is to glue a 1" coupler to the Tee on right.  That will hold anything securely in place using the overflow tube itself.

The whole assembly need to be water tight so the chemicals don't leak a lot into the tank.   Since the assembly is not under any pressure, you can just use PVC glue to put them together without worries.

Water from the fill tube is split into two branches.  The main branch goes into the top of the Tee on right, via a 1/4" hole, drilled with a plastic drill tip so it doesn't slip during drilling.

The 2nd branch fills the chemical chamber, via a dripper or flow restricter or narrower tube or you don't even need a 1st branch.  When the chamber overflows, the cleaning solution goes into the flow tube.

Since the overflow tube and the 1" Tee is only loose fit, I put some plumber's pudding on the edge of the flow tube to seal, so chemicals can't leak into the tank.  I don't think you need it because instead of NOT allowing drop-in-tank cleaner manufacturers to destroy flippers and gaskets, the new standard seems to require everything in the tank to withstand cleaner chemicals.  I spend time for this new design because chlorine destroys drippers for gardening drip irrigation.  It only lasted for a couple of months though it is dirt cheap.

If your fill valve ever malfunctions, water goes into the overflow tube horizontally via the Tee on right.  The "critical fill level" changed a little but you can adjust it.  I think this is or can be plumbing code compliance.  A simpler gadget will be based on 3/4" pipes and fittings.  A 3/4" tube goes nicely and tightly into the overflow tube.  There is no possibility of leaks.  But the effective overflow tube size is reduced to 3/4".

1" chlorine tablets simply drops into the chamber.  But I am experimenting with something better.  Let's see this in the tank. (The old Flushmaster is there totally unused.)

Recap: standard 1/4" pipes, for fridge icemaker or gardening drip irrigation goes straight into the white fill tube.  Pick the slighter tougher ones and you can insert it far into the fill tube, forming a water tight joint.  You also need a 1/4" tee and a dripper.  I'm experimenting with the flow rate but currently I have a 2 GPH dripper.

I have an older version that uses 1" chlorine tablets.

To reduce the swimming pool smell, you can make the tank lid reasonably air tight, or you can use a standard 1" plug to cover the Tee at the chamber opening.  The dripper is inside the plug so it will not hinder the chlorine tablets when taken out with the plug.  I rotated the chamber so it is lower profile to fit into the tank with the plug half in.

Chlorine tablets can go through standard 1" pipes, tees and caps, but NOT plugs.  So you have to allow enough space if you use plugs instead of caps.

I do not recommend expensive 1/4 tee's.  It's easy to take the tubes out but only when not inside the tank for months.  Drip irrigation tee's are much cheaper.  If you ever need to disconnect the tubes, cut the tubes, discard the tee and the tubes.

To really reduce the chlorine smell, like any drain you can add a u-trap at the open tee.  It's clumsy for 1" fittings but there's should be enough space for that.  The u-trap should be refilled with fresh water every flush.  The top level of the u-trap should be slight higher than the overflow tube so water will go into it rather than the tank.

Again, there's nothing wrong with the Flushmaster, but you can be environmentally friendlier.  First, they use a lot more chemical than required.  Their new patent sort of admitting that, or, you do not need to buy expensive slow dissolving tablets to avoid refilling too often.  They design the rubber seal so flimsy that you cannot refill it yourself with chlorine tablets. You can at most reuse the o-ring a few times.  I have yet to find o-ring in hardware store to fit without using pliers to twist the cartridge out.  My design works at low pressure and you don't need any seals.

As for the new chemical, I can hint that it is very cheap and easy to find.  If your tank is larger you can fit in a few chambers and you might not need to refill in a year's time.  I have calculated the solubility of chemicals and nothing seem to last a week  unless you make some large crystals so they dissolve much slower.  But this is barking the wrong tree totally.  You'll see.

Super flush and sparkle a great success

The little hardware used almost immediately earn it's worth.  The chlorine tablets for swimming pools are much cheaper, last for weeks each, and you can even find it in Albertsons's supermarkets.  The pungent chlorine odour for the first flush in the morning is gone.  The toilet bowl remains crystal clear.  When it's not so clear you know it's time to add tablets.

The dual flush conversion doesn't work.  Its because the toilet bowl (not the tank) do not fill up full every time.  Using siphon to continuously fill the toilet bowl isn't practical.  Too risky.

The dripper did get blocked after some weeks.  But it's very cheap.  Now I'm using those that can be opened up to unblock or to see what happened.

Multi-flush toilet problems

Previously I discovered that my old 13G toilet can use as little water as new dual flush toilets, and maybe even less, because I have 2nd chances.

The adjustable flappers can reduce the water usage but maintain powerful flush. The problem is the refilling of the toilet bowl. Because less water is used, the tank refills faster, but the toilet bowl do not have enough time to refill, about an inch or less water level. This lead to very poor flush. Because of the poor flush, the toilet bowl will still be full after flush. So the next flush will be perfect. I call this odd-even flush phenomena.

You still save water if you need to flush twice for the even flush. Sadly no conventional valve can be adjusted to refill faster.

My experiment is to siphon water from the tank down the toilet bowl continuously with a driper. My estimate is that about 10 liter of water is wasted per day this way. So it is equivalent to a few flushes. So if the toilet is used a few times a day it will break even. The problem is having enough time in between flushes for the bowl to refill.

Multi-user personal multi/dual flush toilet conversion

If you want to save water, you really need multi-volume flush. Kids are different from adults. Boys are different from girls. Morning is different from night. And each meal is different.

Also I have a huge tank that money can't buy. It looks brand new and will last forever. The bowl do have hairline cracks inside but with my constant automatic bleaching system, you can't notice the cracks. You can see the cracks only if there are dirt or water deposits - not possible with constant bleach and crystal clear water.

They are many incentives and tricks to get you to get a new toilet. All the toilet seats now do not fit the mounting holes of older toilets. But I got a slightly flexible one that will fit!

The adjustable flapper is fairly consistent. It flushes about the same volume of water every time (except for the different level of water in the bowl due to different refill times). So this is the flush number one.

Holding the flush handle for a couple of sec more is pretty easy, and many people already have been doing it. The less water flush #1 uses, the less is the time to hold the handle for flush #2 and #3 etc.

The only thing needed is to visualize the level of water in the tank and let go of the handle at the right moment. This can be done by a vertical, calibrated, tube outside of the tank. But this is inconvenient to look at.

Electronic water level detection is easy and cost almost nothing. So there will be a bank of LED's for indicating the level in the tank, digitally. You can also use different tones or sophisticated displays. But the aim is to compete with those $20 conversion kits. LED cost at most a few dollars per pack.

You need one simplest transistor and a few resistors per level. That's cost about nothing. The circuit is trivial and I will give you one when I come round to it. Water is about a 20k resistor, the presence and absence of which is a reliable switch. Using one AAA battery, the transistor drives one LED when water is absent.

A low current design is required for the battery to last long, say, a couple of months. But it's simpler to enable the circuit only when the flush handle is turned. An AAA battery will probably last for a year or two. And a normally cutoff circuit minimize corrosion due to electrolysis.

Your dual-flush toilet conversion kit may not work

And here's my very cheap multi-flush system.

I think I still have the 13 L (3.4 G) flush toilet, or even larger. It's pretty easy to use inexpensive hardware to save water to 6 L or less (<1 .6="" a="" almost="" and="" br="" can="" don="" dual-flush="" easy="" flush.="" for="" g="" have="" i="" it="" lot="" man="" more="" nothing.="" per="" poor="" pretty="" s="" save="" t="" than="" think="" this="" to="" water="" you="">
If you have the post-1994 6 L low flow toilets, the first generations don't even flush well for the full volume. What can you achieve by halving the volume?

There's another complication during tank refill. The bowl is also refilled via the overflow tube (the tube in the middle of the tank). The water at the level of the bowl will depend on the volume of the last flush, which dictates the refill time and hence the refilled volume. This may not occur if your fill valve is way over refilling the bowl, or you use those kits that come with it's fill valve too.

You can do tests before deciding to convert. The motivation is that you need to empty your tank for installing anything. It can be messy depending on what is deposited and accumulated in your tank.

Before you test, you have to understand that there are at least 3 levels of flush. The least volume required is flush for pure liquid. The next I will call it paper flush, for paper plus liquid. The most volume required is solid flush. You can also add floater flush, 3-day-after flush, you know what I mean.

It happened that all my toilets have an adjustable flapper already in it, the sort with a scaled dial to vary the volume. It cost a tiny bit more than the cheapest flapper. First you adjust the fill valve to increase the volume in the tank to the maximum level, leaving a safe margin (~1 inch?) below the overflow tube. Then you test by adjusting the flapper to get the desired flush. If you do not have an adjustable flapper, you can just keep the flapper open by hand and measure the water levels at the tank.

I found out that for my old toilet, 4 to 6 L is required for all the 3 different flushes. That means you do not gain anything if you have already a low flow toilet. If you have a high efficient low flow, you may still flush a lot of things by reducing the volume.

Let me say it this way, if you add food dye at the bowl, the amount of water you need to flush depends on how much dye you use. So you can't get away with much less than 5L of water all the time. Actually for pure liquid, you don't really need to flush. You can just add water at the bowl via the overflow tube, until the food dye disappears.

If the volume is enough to flush paper, you don't need much more water to flush solids.

So, if dual-flush is pretty useless, do I need a new $500 dual-flush toilet to really save water?

No. It dawned on me people do dual-flush all the time. By holding onto the flush handle, people empty the whole tank of water into the bowl to achieve a mega flush, when the normal flush fails.

So this is my ideal of a multi-flush system for almost nothing:

Firstly, there is the tube at the top of the tank, coming up from the back of the tank. This is just to push the fill valve open with a ring of tube, through the hole at the back of the tank, and refill the bowl via the overflow tube. You stop pushing when all the color of the food dye disappears. This is a bad 3-minute implementation but someone can improve on it.

The indicator is the main component of the multi-flush system, located at the corner of the tank, just below the flush handle. This is just a 1/4 standard fridge water tube, with the other end at the bottom of the tank.

You can see two mark at the tube indicator. The top mark is the level of the full tank. The bottom mark is the level when the flapper closes by itself. Currently this is about 5L, enough to flush paper and solids most of the time.

This is the normal or number 1 flush. Before the flapper closes (before the water level drops below the bottom mark), you hold on to the handle and let the water level drop some more, until you think it's enough. So you have multiple flush levels.

Having an old powerful toilet has its advantages above those poor low flow ones. If the number 1 flush fails, I still have up to 10 L of water in the tank to complete the task immediately, instead of having to wait for the tank to refill.

If this is a guest room toilet I don't recommend it at all. Here I would recommend a single 5 to 7 L flush, and tell all the family only to use this bathroom for solids only, but don't tell the guests.

If you have small kids that don't understand much, you can have a bathroom with 3-4 L for boys only, and a bathroom for girls with 5L for liquid and paper flush. If you really need to save the planet, you have to teach them that pale yellow is OK, and residue white paper in the bowl is OK.

The indicator is just a tube that runs over the back of the tank, below the lid, to the bottom of the tank. At the moment I tape the tube to the tank with packing tape. The L-bend quick connector you see is just to avoid curving the tube too much. At the beginning, you have to siphon out the air in the tube, using your mouth or a baby ear and nose pump.

ps Don't leave the tube for long without securing the end. If the end of the tube drops down, the tank will drain and the refill valve will open forever. This lead to another better idea.

Fluidmaster Flush 'n sparkle improved

The Fluidmaster Flush 'n sparkle fits in the toilet tank. It dispense cleaning chemicals whenever it flushes. You can keep the whole toilet bowl clean without brushing.

It's an improvement over those drop-in-the-tank solid blocks. A typical one is by Clorox, a 3 inch diameter block, which dissolves slowly in the tank, and is suppose to last for a couple of months. If you are single, or a working couple leading an active lifestyle, it would probably last that long.

The only chemical you want is chlorine bleach. The acidity neutralizes the calcium deposits in water that form water stains. The problem is that for the first flush in the morning, you will be overwhelmed with chlorine, like swimming in the pool just after chlorination, and much worse.

More importantly, chlorine attacks soft plastic used for flapper parts. You need to get chemical resistance flappers, now commonly sold.

The flush 'n sparkle is an improvement. The refill block is smaller, designed to last as long as those Clorox blocks, which isn't that long. You still smell chlorine especially in the morning. By dispensing straight into the bowl, chemical attacks are eliminated.

But still the FNS dispenses too much bleach, needs refill too fast and too expensive. Here is the improvement.

The white tubes and parts are the original FNS, going from the valve and into the overflow tube. The parts added are the splitting T, and a 1 GPH dripper. To join the parts, I use standard 1/4 inch (OD) tubes, which are used for the fridge, and drip irrigation.

The tubes used in toilet tanks are 1/4 ID (internal diameter) tubes. I can't find parts for it, but standard 1/4 OD tubes fits inside it nicely, as in the picture.

The splitter ensures that there are enough water going into the toilet bowl, independent on how much water coming out from the dripper. Here I use quick connect, or John Guest, which is under $3. The alternative is to use much cheaper T's used in drip irrigation. But those T's restricts the flow somewhat, reducing the level of water in the toilet.

The dripper ensures that bleach is dispensed in drops. Don't use those flag drippers that can be opened and cleaned. They may leak.

Using rubber bands, I tied the tube from the dripper to the original clip of the FNS. In theory, both refill tubes should be above the overflow tube, so water from the tank is impossible to contaminate via the inlet valve.

Drinking tubes for the fridge would probably work but you really need is a tough 1/4 OD tube to insert into the white tubes with 1/4 ID, and into the splitter. It also need to be elastic enough to hold the dripper well. The quality of drip irrigation tupes vary so you need to pick a good one.

The whole thing can be installed in a minute.

Also, the setup was designed to use much cheaper 1 inch diameter chlorine blocks for swimming pools. I will be saving money if each small block last for a few days. And I would like to add blocks say every week or longer.

Here is the improved Flush drip 'n sparkle in action:

Homemade Automatic toilet bowl cleaner

 For the many updates, check label "toilet"

I'm talking about:

Kaboom Scrub Free!
Fluidmaster Flush 'N Sparkle

I stumbled upon the earliest form of toilet tank mounted cleaner on the net many years ago. The idea is so good that I brought it. It looked a little more complicated as there seemed to be a miniature valves into and out of the cleaning tablet housing. I was let to believe that the valves were the important part, controlling the correct dosage of the chemical.

Everything was good except that the chemical didn't last. I thought I had the idea of waiting for one of the giants to enter the market and they can produce some decent chemicals. I actually asked the website about plumbing code, whether it's safe without the possibility of back flow. I think the toilet valve itself guarantees that. The website soon disappeared and I thought it folded.

I think Kaboom is the next to pick up the idea. It was well made and the hardware was free too. I think I still have the early version called No Scrub somewhere under the sink. It used crystals and was still dissolving too fast. I don't think it last 3 months. The housing is a bit big and I thought of putting something else in it too but if I never thought I can come up with something better than them. The lid is screwed on and it's a bit hard to open it to refill.

Than came the Fluidmaster Flush 'N Sparkle. It's more professional. It's compact. The cartridge is easier to pull out and replace, because there's an O ring to seal the housing, requiring less effort than just a screw cap. The major advantage is that it's available in hardware stores together with other Fluidmaster hardware. Again it doesn't seem to last 3 months or 1000 flushes, but long enough.

Yes, all the stuff works well. You don't really need to scrub. Try the Clorox tablets, 3" white bleaching blocks in supermarkets and everywhere. You drop the thing into the tank and that's it. The problem is that you can't control the dose. In the morning the first flush is concentrated chlorinated water. It's worse if your toilet has no windows, relying on extraction fans for the ventilation. The other problem is that chlorine attacks the soft rubber flapper of the flush valve. I think you have to replace them, say, every year or two. Consequently there are chlorine/ chemical resistance versions in the hardware stores. It's trivial to replace the flappers, but it cost a few dollars, and otherwise those things never break.

The only thing you need is chlorine tablets like Clorox. It's simple chemistry. Hard water contains mineral which are calcium minerals, or from natural lime stones. To dissolve them you need acid, and chlorine react with water to form hydrochloric acid. I hate corporations trying to sell bacteria killing stuff to ignorance housewives. Bacteria cannot survive without water and air. And if chemicals can kill bacteria they can also kill you in sufficient amounts. This time chlorine tablets are over kill for killing bacteria. In this case, you really don't need to kill bacteria in the toilet. There's plenty of them and they don't come back. Bye. The bad thing is that they will kill the good bacteria in the septic system.

Other cleaners without bleach are just like detergents, surface agents preventing dirt from sticking on the surface of the toilet bowl. They don't work that well against lime and definitely not on lime filled toilets. With chlorine tablets old toilets will become sparkling white with time, if the surfaces aren't damaged by scrubbing. The other acid cleaner are CLR, now with an organic acid form. It's as good as any toilet bowl cleaners. But I can't find any slowing dissolving acid in tablet form.

As for environmental impact, chlorine isn't that harmful. A small amount isn't toxic as it's used in most swimming pools and in the water. Chlorine will eventually form natural occurring stable mineral salts, which is totally harmless. As long as you can use as little as possible, you don't waste resources to produce it and minimize changing the acidity of the discharge environment.

The Fluidmaster is good but I have 3 toilets. I have to replace them all in one to two months. Sometimes I was too lazy to do it and it cost about $8 each? Using a brush and a liquid bleach every few months isn't a big deal, until one toilet turned black at one of the surface cracks. Well, the option is to replace the toilet that isn't necessary and too big a deal if I were to do it myself. If you keep it sparkling white you can't see the cracks.

The story goes: one day I found an old Clorox tablet 3" in diameter. I found out that the Fluidmaster cartridge can be opened to refill. So I crushed the tablet into smaller pieces and put them back in the cartridge.

I searched the net and if you have a swimming pool, you know what I was thinking. I found those 1" diameter chlorine blocks for swimming pools. Buy many swimming pool owners have thought of it and tried it. One plumber guy used it and do not recommend it mainly because the tablets are of different dissolving rates and the swimming pool is a lot of water compared to the toilet tank. But he was dropping the blocks into the tank like the Clorox ones.

I think those swimming pool chlorine tablets will work well. Firstly they are slow dissolving. They are much cheaper than those for toilets. The 1" ones fit right into the Fluidmaster cartridge that I measured. If these tablets dissolve too fast and you loose money compared to using the original cartridges, you can leave some time gaps between replacing the tablets. Acid is rather good in dissolving old calcium deposits. You just need to replace the tablets before deposits become visible, or just become visible.

Further down the road I don't think you even need the dispenser. It's pretty cheap to make one perhaps. If not you can just make one to show off. Parts:

1.5" diameter PVC tube (enough to accept 1" tablets)
John guest adapters on both ends, or tube adapters
two sort tubes

The tube used in the toilet valve seems to be not the standard 1/4" tubes, but at least they are standard. You must be able to find it in the hardware stores or cut the original piece into two. The installation becomes inserting the outlet tube into the central tube of the tank, securing using fancy clamps or just rubber bands. You can mount the whole thing at the side of the tank of just drop the sealed tube into the water.

You can have a fancy union to make it easy to open the tube and refill tablets. Really there are plenty of space in the tank to do some awesome stuff.